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1971 October 9th Inglewood Unit 15 Of Understanding Daniel Fry On Areas Of Mutual Agreement Part One

Understanding Audio Transcript

Recording structure

• [00:00] Opening remarks and introduction
• [12:07] Main address
• [37:02] Development of the main themes
• [55:13] Questions and closing discussion

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[00:00] Opening remarks and introduction

The following is a speech given by Dr. Daniel W. Frey at the International Unit of Understanding in Englewood, California, on Saturday, October 9, 1971. I know that we're all just anxious and waiting to hear from Dr. Frey, so will you come up, Dr. Frey? Let's give him a big hand. Welcome to Englewood Unit No. 15 of Understanding. Thank you. It's pleasure to be here. I don't get down as often as I'd like to. We have some 80 units now, and if I got one every week, it'd still be here. I'm going to use some notes on this talk tonight. I don't usually do that.

People have said, oh, Dr. Frey, that's a lecture for a couple of hours any time, and I've used some notes. Well, I'm not going to lecture for a couple of hours tonight, so relax. However, this does take about 35 to 40 minutes. It is probably not the most interesting lecture that I have ever given. I feel that it is by far the most important, and it is one that has been given in rather important places. I was asked this spring or this summer to come back to Washington, D.C. again. It was like... It was like...

It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like...

It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like...

It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... It was like... West Berlin now maybe it was a coincidence I don't know if it was it was a remarkable one the coincidence or not it was very encouraging to hear my

own words coming back word for word from a gentleman like Brace never so I'm going to use the notes I could do it without notes and have many times accepted quite a bit of work has been done on this and it has been brought down this way to the briefest presentation it is only necessary to read the front page of any metropolitan daily newspaper today to realize that our society is in serious trouble social concepts and postulates which for centuries have been considered indisputable are now being questioned ignored or openly defied respect for all types of authority is rapidly

disappearing many philosophers and statesmen are beginning to fear that the whole fabric of society may break down plunging the world into unimaginable chaos and possible nuclear extermination thousands of men and positions of leadership are working sometimes almost desperately to spend the time and to bolster in one way or another the sagging social structure unfortunately most of these men are specialists in relatively national and international affairs and in some cases even in the political

narrow field and their efforts are devoted primarily to coping with the symptoms rather than determining the nature of the illness for example Reserve Board chairman Arthur Burns recently admitted in France and his words were widely copied in the Time magazine and in the Swiss magazine recently admitted that quote the rules of economics are not working quite the way they used to the fact is that few if any of the rules of society are likely ever again to work exactly as they used to and the danger is that unless the reasons become better understood the

rules may never work at all it is not only desirable therefore but it is imperative to consider first the one great basic deficiency of society from which most of its problems arise the social science has been defined as the study of the relationship of man to his fellow man and of the means by which that relationship may be made more successful more productive and more enduring colleges and universities list courses in the social science and governments spend billions of dollars and hours of effort upon the fact remains however that no genuine

scientific foundation has ever been established for this study it has

[12:07] Main address

developed only as an art rather than the science which it is called and which it must become if it is to furnish practical solutions to the present and future problems of mankind most leaders and many would-be leaders of men formulate their own doctrines concerning the proper attitude and actions of man towards his fellow man each of these doctrines if published will usually attract followers in some cases the followers may be few in other cases entire nations or races may become eager and devout followers yet those who follow each leader do so

primarily because of the aesthetic or the emotional appeal of the doctrine rather than because of any tested and proven merits thus a continuing series of more or less random social experiments have been conducted throughout the ages by those whose public position has enabled them to influence the thoughts and actions of their neighbors some of these experiments have been partly or wholly successful others have been total failures and some of them have brought terrible tragedy and destruction to whole races of people we only have to

consider Nazism for example is one of these this is a doctrine created essentially by one man who became a leader in the position of leadership among the people and told a certain idea certain concepts of how man should react to his fellow man and it's brought terrible tragedy and destruction to a whole nation in fact to many nations of people yet none of these experiments be they successful or otherwise could contribute significantly to the science of human relationships because none of them were designed from built upon or

or even had reference to any foundation of universally accepted facts or even beliefs. If we consider the branch of knowledge and inquiry usually known as the physical science, we find it to be a true science in that the area of mutual agreement has long since been determined and documented. The process through which the documentation was achieved was not a natural or an automatic one. It required planning and dedication on the part of those who carried it out. The beliefs of each leader in the field were compared with the beliefs of others, and where

differences existed, specific tests were devised based upon the areas of which they did agree to determine the relative merits of the differing theories. Since the postulates upon which the tests were based had been accepted in advance by all concerned, all were equally bound by the rules. The results of the tests, and would accept those tests, at least until some still better theories or better tests were formulated. Consequently, there has never been a war or even a major feud resolving for any difference of opinion in the physical science.

It stands upon a foundation of mutual agreement and has a built-in method of settling disputes and resolving differences. In a social science, on the other hand, the area of mutual agreement, which is the area of mutual equality, is certainly large and general, has never been specifically defined or documented. Therefore, there is no foundation from which mutually acceptable tests or means of determination can be formulated. When large numbers of people, and sometimes whole nations or races, are led to adopt basic

suppositions and beliefs that differ substantially from the suppositions and beliefs of others, a constantly increasing number of people are forced to adopt such beliefs. The increasing friction is likely to develop between the groups. Since there are no adequate or accepted means of testing the merits of the opposing concepts, the heat of emotion generated by the continuing friction may and frequently does lead to open warfare. Now, the tragedy and the futility of warfare lies in the fact that it cannot determine the relative merits of a conflicting ideology.

It cannot be determined. It can only demonstrate the relative fighting abilities of the participants. No matter how violent or how prolonged the war, and no matter who may be the victor, there will still have been no approach to a solution to the problems or the differences that brought about the fighting. In a few months or a few years, when the contenders have recovered somewhat from their wounds, they will be ready to fight again. Now, these words, this particular phrase, are not just a metaphor.

They are a metaphor for the world. This particular quotation was written first in 1966 quite some time before the last Arab-Israeli conflict. And yet never in history were these words more precisely illustrated than in that case. Here are a group of Asians holding opposing concepts who have fought three times and are getting ready to fight the fourth time without ever having saw the end of the war. And yet, they are not ready to fight the fourth time without ever having saw the end of the war.

It's a long-term saying and a time where all the violent conflicts and conflicts of the world have probably been resolved there by a single one, for the differences of opinion that brought about the fighting. When the contenders have recovered somewhat from their wounds, they will be ready to fight again. In a few months or a few years, when the winners have recovered somewhat from their wounds, they will be ready to fight again. The winner usually learns nothing from such an encounter.

And if the loser learns anything, it will be only how to avoid the worst of his military errors. So long as a civilization possesses only simple weapons of the military, a punch is the limit. It is a cost. Otherwise, the situation is simply being understood. of limited destructive power it can tolerate and it may survive these periodic acts of tragic nonsense millions of innocent persons may meet violent and untimely death and hundreds of years

of patient human efforts may be wiped out at the passing whim of one leader and still the race and at least some part of its culture will survive to begin again the seemingly endless struggle toward peace and security when weapons of total destruction come into being however the situation changes for no civilization and no race and survive the holocaust of the weapons now being created and i have reason to write this because for the past 25 years i've been employed in one capacity you and other which resulted in creation of things that could be used in such weapons i'm very

familiar with the capacity of the weapons presently being created it is clear that the only choice now left to mankind is hamlet's choice to be or not to be every reasoning individual every parent and every leader of men must now ask himself this question will i leave to my children and to the children of those who look to me for guidance a world filled with beauty and opportunity as is their rightful heritage or will their charred and broken bodies be strewn about a burned out planet orbiting the sun as a perpetual memorial to the ultimate failure of logic and reason let no man make the tragic mistake of thinking that the problems of mankind may somehow solve the problems of mankind and the problems of mankind

solve themselves if only we can manage to ignore them long enough or that we can safely delegate to others the responsibility of their solution and this is where we have gone astray so much in the present time we we're all somewhat aware of the problems of mankind but we've got some organizations we've got some organizations that are set up to maintain peace and so forth and we say let let you all do it let them do it their they're straight up for that they know what they're doing we hope and why doesn't the United Nations solve the problems of country and in examining the work of these United Nations so forth you find again one one basic flaw one

thing that prevents them from being it in fact they're as successful as they should be this came up in the lecture a couple of months ago actual in Oregon there was a large rotary group and there were about 150 the top businessmen of the area president and the question in that nation's came up why wasn't it more effective and more efficient and I said well I know one reason I said how many of you men here present they know the name of your representative of the United Nations the man who represents you and out of the 150 not a single hand went up

after a few moments of embarrassed silence i had to admit that I didn't know either nobody knows because we have no representation as individuals we have represented as a government or nations were set up by government to represent government and perhaps necesities really good job I don't know when it's about the united nations you have the amount of reasons it doesn't work better than it does because the general public doesn't even know

what it's doing in any one case we see something on television that some member of the united nations is going somewhere to talk to someone we never hear what they talk about we never hear what conclusions are reached the only role of the public in such a thing is as always to pay the bill and to take the rap for whatever decisions may be reached even though they have no idea those decisions have been reached or what they were so there isn't the public backing for a group like united nations that should be and would be otherwise if they were more truly representative of peoples of nations instead of government that's a problem that occurs in all sorts of public representation of the individual for untold centuries man

has cried peace peace and there has been no peace thousands of intelligent and learned men have devoted their lives to the church for peace and tens of millions have fought to the death for it sounds a little odd millions of men fighting to the death for peace and yet it's true if you look through history the first war that was fought specifically to end all wars occurred as i recall about 500 years ago before the birth of christ it's in history you can find it there are nations we're fighting on each side of the same rope and this war is going to end all wars and we have since

that time had five other wars that were fought specifically to end all wars we haven't quite done it yet if anyone knows who believes in history it is time we face the fact that peace can never be reached through any direct approach it is not as gold which can be obtained by gold it is not as gold which can be obtained by gold it is not as gold which can be obtained by sufficient digging nor is it as a treasure which can be had at once if only one knows where to look peace is simply the automatically resulting byproduct of complete understanding between man and man between state and state and between all men and god when such understanding exists there's no need to search or to work for peace it exists automatically but until understanding

has been achieved no amount of effort for peace can ever be successful we have been making efforts for peace without achieving understanding for thousands of years we're no closer to it now than we were before without understanding no amount of effort for peace can ever be successful let us therefore direct our thoughts and our efforts toward the goal of complete understanding it is the one great catalyst that can make all problems soluble as a first step in the achievement of world understanding we must begin for the first time in the history of this planet to create the only foundation upon which a true social science or any true science can be built there are no obstacles except the magnitude of the test and its great success in the physical science

should demonstrate to everyone how well it works let us consider therefore the following proposal and this is a proposal which has resulted from some eight years of a concentrated study of this sudden very simple as the thing in the world not speaking the world except the massive nature of the test some presently existing international organizations should be enlisted or a new one created if necessary for the purpose of sponsoring a worldwide congress composed of representatives of every major and insofar as may be possible every minor nation race ideology and thought in the ideal case there should be representation of every group of people

whose members have any thought patterns that are common to the group now this is the ideal i said in the ideal case because obviously this would involve not thousands of representatives but hundreds of thousands of representatives so at some point the ideal case must compromise with something that is practical in the ideal case there should be representation of every group of people whose members have any thought pattern which are common to the group the delegates from each nation race or ethnic group shall be chosen only by that group which they are to represent and this is one thing we never really do in in politics or in much of anything else our representatives are authorities

in some fields and the authority in the field seldom actually represents the nature of thinking of the individual in the field they shall be persons who are fully aware of the basic thinking of their groups the congress shall have one purpose only to determine through mutual discussion and to document to the minutes of the meeting all of those principles postulates and rules or methods of procedure which are found by all of the delegates to be generally accepted as valid principles of the social relationship of mankind no attempt shall be made by any individual or group to influence the thinking or to mold the opinion of any other individual or group since the purpose of the congress is not to determine what the people of the world should think

but only to discover what they do think any suggestion or postulate which after brief discussion is found to be unacceptable by any delegate shall immediately be dropped from consideration and the next suggestion shall be taken up if however the majority of the delegates find the item to be acceptable and it is rejected by a minority a note will be made describing the discarded principle the delegate or group who found it to be unacceptable and the reasons given if any although none need be given these notes may prove helpful to any subsequent congress which may be held for the purpose of enlarging updating or amending the original document now i put this in only because this is the way the physical science the foundation

area of the physical science was created physical science that has put men on the moon when the social science hasn't been decided whether man should have enough food or should start to death in the event these notes should certainly aid in the understanding of the thought patterns of the various groups a number of sample postulates should be prepared in advance of the first formal meeting but after these have been considered each delegate in turn shall have the right and the duty to propose additional items for consideration by the assembly each suggestion shall have a direct bearing upon the relationship of man to his fellow man upon the means by which that relationship may be made more successful more productive or more

enduring they shall be stated in the simplest possible terms so that they may be readily understood by all each suggestion shall be individually considered and accepted or rejected by a vote of the judge those postulates which are accepted shall be recorded and documented as recognized and accepted factors in the social science for convenience and order in making the suggestions they should be grouped into specific areas of human needs human desires human relationships ecological requirements and so forth they should begin in each of the fields with the simplest proposals or postulates that can be conceived and expressed since a foundation must be built upon the ground and not at some distance

and this is our problem with the so-called social science there is a high-rise building a towering multi-story structure which has never had a first floor or even a foundation it stands tottering upon pillars of postulates which have been accepted for centuries without ever having been tested we've got the same problem in the physical science and they keep referring back to physical science because i've been in the field for many years i know how conclusions are reached we don't have to kill each other because we have a difference of opinion we have ways in which we can decide whose idea is the best and we use the best idea no matter whose it was but in the beginning when these physical signs first began to be documented we had many

ideas that had been taught for centuries they were totally false for example the idea that a large body of matter would fall past it and the body of the same kind of matter that is a large cannonball with all factors in the small cannonball that had been taught and accepted in such science as it was 50,000 years and Galileo questioned they said I wonder if that's really true or not nobody ever tried it you know he thought of you here so we took a large cannonball and small cannonball and he took him up on the leading tire that these any drop them off at the same time and everybody was

amazed to discover that they both hit the ground at the same time but while a large cannonball had more weight it had more downward force and this is why it feels this reason except it says the reason that everyone will fall faster than the lighter one because there's more downward force so it will accelerate more rapidly and what nobody realized was that bodies of matter also have inertia as they resist acceleration and the large body resist acceleration more than the small one does so they both accelerate at the same speed the thing as simple as that was taught in

correctly for thousands of years since it says nobody thought of testing sound logical and so nobody tested it well we've done the same thing in the social science for just as many thousands of years we've accepted postulates they've never been tested in our whole social sciences is built upon these tottering postulates which have never been tested in the area of human needs for example the following postulates might be offered resolved that it is better to do simply than do simply that all persons should have available to them a sufficient amount of nourishing food than that most of them should suffer

constantly from hunger and malnutrition note that this is purely an academic question this acceptance would not find the delegates or the group to any course of action whatever but would only establish the validity of the principle now when I first read this for our own home group of understanding in Merlin one wanted to see this for the most part but it was not as expensive and it was not a good of the ladies who was a tireless worker for understanding in the fatigue of a worker said that I don't know whether I would dare to vote for that or not because if I voted for that and someone might expect me to share some of my foods with someone who didn't have enough we see this is an extrapolation

this is the difficulty of accepting any starkly simple principle people just can't do it they have to add something to it they have to extrapolate and then they judge it on the basis of what they have extrapolated to what they've added to it this doesn't say a thing that she would be bound by accepting the principle that it would be better if everyone had sufficient food then I didn't wouldn't bind anyone to do anything about it but it does illustrate something would happen I mean really it was a conscience getting to work and she said if I dare to accept it would be better if people had food then maybe I

ought to do something about it and this is the thing that gets to work when you establish simple principle there's nothing binding about the simple principles itself but once they have been universally accepted then there is a universal need or universal action on the conscience to begin at least to try to do something about it would only establish the validity of the principle at first such a proposal might seem to be so obvious as to be ridiculous yet the fact remains that its universal acceptance has never been tested or documented we just assume that

that's a fact if the postulate were accepted and it probably would be if the proposal were made at a time when the assembly has been without food for some hours it would then become a recognized and documented principle and the way would be open for other simple and basic suggestions as to means for implementation of the first I put this in in this way because this illustrates one of the ways in which all people on earth are identical everyone gets hungry about every so often and if you do as we have done and

of course and understanding you get a ream or two of paper and on one side of this paper you begin listing the ways in which all people are the same and on the other side you begin listing the ways in which they are different the ways in which all people are the same out scripts the ways in which they are different three or four to one for every way you think that they're different you see two ways that they are the same I gave this lecture for kinetics foundation to go and one of the gentleman said he took the exception he said I think people are different in a lot more

ways than they're the same and I said oh how so and he said well I'm a doctor he said I retired from doctors because I couldn't accept some of the practices but he said I had to open hundreds of cadavers of bodies and I found that some people had the tubes coming out of the

[37:02] Development of the main themes

heart came out in one way and some came out in the other way the hearts were all a little bit different and the tubes coming out so this made everybody different I said did you ever open a body and find that it had no heart well it doesn't mean it's a starting thing there might be minor deviations but the main the main fact is the same for everybody everybody had one and he began talking to some people who have fallen archers and other people don't have fallen archers did you ever see someone who had no archers fallen or otherwise so for every difference between people you find you're automatically creating

another way or several other ways in which they are all the same and this primary possible was put in in this way because this is one of the ways in which all people are the same they all require food about every so often it should always be remembered however that the purpose of the Congress is not to solve the problems of society but only to create a tool with which those problems might successfully be approached most politics operates today the public can't quite understand why I'm saying and I'll never really get with this in realism but of course they can never

really read it and the speaking of speaking as the politician does doesn't give much of an idea what the situation is or what he proposes to do about it as the number of building blocks and the foundation grew one by one and as the delegates began to realize most of them for the first time the remarkable similarity in each other's thinking when reduced to fundamentals the enthusiasm and the rate of progress would steadily increase in the area of human relationship the beginning postulate might be

resolved that it is better that man should live in peace and cooperation with his neighbor than that his works and his good to be destroyed and he should be maimed or killed in battle with his fellow man such a postulate might or might not be accepted but if it were than other simple concepts leading to implementation might be considered such an approach to the social science may seem to be childishly oversimplified and indeed it is but if we are ever to succeed in building a true social science we must begin at the beginning and we have never yet done so a similar process was employed in the development

of the physical science and its success speaks for itself when the congress has completed its deliberations when all principles rules and methods of procedure that can be conceived by the delegates have been considered and voted upon the resulting document shall be translated into all the principal languages of the earth and made available to all people as the foundation documents and the primary reference work of the social science the preliminary study which has led to this proposal has indicated that the minimum number of delegates required for an acceptable congress will be at the order of one thousand much better number would be three or four or five thousands at some point depending on who sponsored it but it was done

at some point the ideal situation would have to compromise with psychic ability but the larger the number obviously the more valid the resulting work would be the minimum number for an acceptable congress would be of the order of one thousand then the time required for the completion of the primary document will be about one year the overall cost of the congress would be at the order of 20 million dollars a somewhat to the individual may seem to be very large but which is distributed among the population of even a single country such as the united states would amount to less than 10 cents per person not a very large investment when one considers that the welfare of everyone on earth

and the continued existence of civilization almost certainly depends upon our ability to develop some form of social format capable of easing tensions and lessening frictions between nations and between various ethnic groups the organization which sponsors this proposal should conduct additional studies for the purpose of formulating more specific figures as to numbers time and cost okay now we mentioned 20 million sometimes some people gasp over a lot of money it's about one-fourth the cost of one hardened missile base in kansas this has ever driven through kansas and seeing the basis of along the road

about assess the cost of one large modern bombing plane it's the cost of less than two days of the ethnom war in fact it speaks it was less than the cost of one day it might just be the best investment that humanity has ever made the amount of the responsibility of the united states would cost about 10 cents per person the study should also include the most desirable location for the convention the logistics of travel and maintenance of the delegates the linguistic problems and so forth now here the united nations could come in very very handy in fact if they could choose to sponsor such a thing they would have a head start on any other organization that did because they

already have uh coped with the problems of the linguistic problems the logistics of travel the maintenance of the delegates and so forth on quite a large scale we could learn from them that would be something that they could contribute i mean a tremendous amount of information in this respect before any final action is taken to implement the proposal the plan should be publicized throughout the world to the medium of newspapers radio television and so forth it should be discussed in the united nations assembly and other international forums such wide publicity would be neither difficult nor costly to obtain if the proper approach were made there are many people in key positions in the communication systems of the world who are well

aware of the critical position of this civilization and who are willing to do whatever may be done to ease the tensions or find solutions to the problem now about four years ago when i first wrote out the first rough draft for these things i went to washington dc i gave a number of lectures there i appeared on four or five radio and television stations there and somewhere along the line the people who had up the voice of america program became aware of of me and what i was speaking on and someone called me up at my hotel and said how about coming down to the library of congress they have some little audience rooms there and we can set up a little tape recorder and tape about 10 minutes of whatever it is you're

sponsoring whatever it is you're suggesting and maybe we can play it one or even maybe one of two of the stations on which the voice of American broadcast so I said fine and I went down and this young man appeared did right now I'm so our young man was a small portable tape recorder and he set it up and he looked at his watch and he's well I've only got ten minutes because I've gotten important appointments in two minutes but we'll see what we can put on in ten minutes now the end talk on the news agreement the ten minutes became

twenty minutes to twenty minutes became thirty minutes not this time he looked at his wife and oh my gosh I missed the other point well it wasn't important anyhow it's bigger than I thought and just did how much time do you have I looked at my life and well I've got something over two hours before I have to appear radio station he said let me make a phone call we better get a better recorder than this he's a shot to a phone in about ten minutes two more minutes period one of the gentleman was named doobly-doo

and they had a very professional looking tape recorder and they set it up and we talked for two hours on tape when I finally had to break it up and go mr. person said you might be interested to know that we have decided that everything you put on these tapes will be translated into every language in which the voice of America is broadcast which at this time is twenty-six lines and will be broadcast on every station on which the voice of America broadcast and we know approximately how many people listen you know how many people in the Soviet Union listen we know how many people in China you know how many

people in India how many people in Pakistan how many people in North and South America listen he says what you have just put on tape will be heard by two hundred and fifty million people did what do you think of that he was writing a little bit so I see how they didn't have a big audiences too I said that's wonderful I have to agree that that's a good lecture audience two hundred and fifty million there's more people and I've ever talked to at one time before but I said it's less than one-tenth of the world population and if this proposal is going to go over somewhere along the line we have to reach all of them how do

I go about reaching the other nine-tenths let's set him back a little bit because suddenly he realized that this population was less than one-tenth and he smiled at him and said well we can give you two hundred and fifty million I'm crazy you'll have to figure out yourself how you're going to reach the rest so I've been reaching the rest ever since I did this about three months later in Europe in six countries last fall in every country that I elected this lecture was translated into the language of the country was printed in that language and is being distributed in that country state all six of the

countries I liked it in before the thing was translated into their language printed in English what is getting around it I'll put your name on the list I think the list now number some seven hundred and twenty three thousand people are people have asked me how do you see how do you get to see the fine thoughts and I say it's very simple you have to be at the right place at the right time but don't ask me what the right place at the right time is because I don't know I can say that the desire or intent to see one will increase the probability

simply because you'll be looking a lot more more enthusiastically you would otherwise one of the questions that has been brought up by a scientist and so forth on UFO is why is it that when someone sees one in the sky and the newspapers used to carry it in headlines then a lot of people begin seeing who hadn't seen them before and they say well that's this mob psychology somebody sees and so they all have to see and that isn't the answer at all the answer is that everybody is now looking up when someone sees something the newspapers carrier headlines are on us

you walk down the street and everybody's looking up when they never looked up before it doesn't mean there's any more spaceships up there than there were before it just means a lot more people are now seeing them because they're looking up the same question was asked why is it that so many more spaceships are seen in desert areas than they've seen over cities well this isn't quite true a lot of them were seen over cities too but there is a simple fact that the area that you can see the horizon in the desert area is up to a hundred times as large as the horizon in the city in the

city you're looking up between walls of buildings and so forth and you can see maybe a few degrees of the sky if the thing is directly overhead you may see it on the desert you can look over here 150 miles on the horizon and if the thing is there as any size you can see it there's a hundred times more probability of seeing anything if it's there on the desert doesn't mean there's any more there it's just a lot easier to see them there well it is isn't exactly a survival state that is one of the beauties there that it would be ideal if it were needed for survival we hope that it won't be needed for

survival it is an area which could survive very nicely you could build a mile-high wall around all of Josephine County tomorrow and while the inhabitants would have to learn to get along without a few of the things they take for granted now they wouldn't really suffer the area is capable of producing everything that living human beings need in fact there was at one time a very large Indian tribe that occupied that area for centuries before anyone build a supermarket or before anyone invented money nature furnished everything those people needed and they didn't work near

as hard for it as we do now they're a very leisure very relaxed race and they they knew where to get the things they needed and they didn't really work for it at all well the place still produces things I mean they the Oregon state government over a million dollars a year fighting blackberries with them fine it tears them out it roots them out it poisons them and every year loses out every year there are more blackberry lines than there were a year before and only about one-fifth of those blackberries are ever used the animals eat what they can the birds eat what they want and then goes out and takes a few and cans a few and

then gets tired of taking them and the rest go away in our area there were paratrees all over the place that were planted by the orchard company in 1914 to 1918 they all still produce pears every year and most of these pears go to waste I'm ashamed to admit I left 300 pounds of them in my shop when I came down here and probably most of them they were getting ripe at that time unless you can them ripe when they're ripe they can go bad very fast but these were only a small part of what we have on our own trees here just on land that we bought for subdivision and they aren't used for

anything we pick what we can use and I take them and then get them and then we give them away but since I came down here I won't be around to give them all the power of my life will give most of them away there are apples up there we have an apple tree on our property that was planted 119 years ago by a man named Heinz he with his entire family was massacred by the Indians one year later he never saw a bloom on that tree I use it in the lecture on the conservation of effort for good it's the law of nature like the conservation of energy and the conservation of matter and so forth the conservation of good is the law of

nature somewhere if you make any effort for good somewhere the result is going to show up you may never see it but for 119 years that tree has been burning apples every year and every year we take a few less people get some we fix a few and we make a pie and we eat the pie in celebration of dying family who planted that tree 119 years ago and has been furnishing people's apples ever since even though they never saw it and never lived the area is I picked the area when I decided I had to leave California decided sooner or later I have to and I might as well prepare then I started a

little point system so many points for this event and I applied it all over the continental United States in that area came out with the highest number of points I could have gone anywhere in the United States it's the same but that area you have the most advantages aside from just being a survival area I wouldn't plead to a survival area just to survive because in the first place I might not survive any on the second place it wouldn't be worth it I picked that area because it's the best place to live that I could find in continental United States it has the best overall climate it has most

resources and have ample electrical current in case of chateau cousin but in case of nuclear war that would be the only powerless to man and it's all hydroelectric it doesn't require any or anything and it's all generated up and by dams of the middle canyons which are remote from any target areas they go Another where can you even if announcement all of its cities were safer as it was we still have all the electric power movies well anyway I Kunten

new end sudden president that will take his life as a sole southern Oregon southwestern Oregon it's only about 25 miles above the California border Portland has too much rain Portland's annual rainfall is above 45 inches our rainfall is 23.9 the 50-year average

50-year average is 23.9 inches which is considered to be the ideal rainfall for anything less than that is a little too dry anything more than that is a little wetter than that sir I one of the problems of Oregon is it gets its

[55:13] Questions and closing discussion

reputation mostly from its least desirable areas because that's where all the people are Portland is the last place in Oregon I would want to live and yet it contains for the half the population of the state but there was a good day there and ships came in first trading started there and people then filled up the city and the city grew because the people were there not because it was a good place to live on the fourth place in my mind in Oregon to live but for the half the population of the state

but in our area and also Portland gets quite a bit of snow in wintertime and so forth we get a little bit of snow about every third year and it stays on the ground about two or three days and it's gone just long enough the kids have a ball making snowballs it's gone we don't have any continuous snow there any electricity here we didn't have any and most years we don't the temperature is not much different from the temperature here it will freeze about one night out of three in December and January January sometimes in February but it usually reaches the freezing point just

an hour or two before dawn where the temperature dips everywhere and don't think it doesn't do it in California lives involved in the park for a couple years and I had been up there and the temperature is quite mild up there I came down in the Baldwin Park I had a faucet that high above the ground the drift I came out three mornings and it was nice to go all the way down to the ground from that faucet and when water freezes on the run it's cold I don't care what the Chamber of Commerce says is the official weather when I was working for Eric that we had a winter that was so cold and every we listened

today we listened to the weather report every morning he's come on well it was in the effort 42 degrees again in Los Angeles last night it's pretty cold it got down to 42 degrees one day he revolted he said it got down to 42 degrees that's what it says here and I'm reading it but he says it was a pretty darn cold 42 degrees because when I came to work this morning it was ice all over the street that's the last time he ever ever announced in his last time they ever came on I don't know whether they shot him or whether they fired him that's the last time it was

perfectly true when he came to work it was ice all over the street and the temperature got down to a minimum of 42 degrees but that's the last time they ever announced the weather too well I think I've done that already when someone says what does he look like the only answer I can say is pick the most ordinary features the most ordinary man you can conceive of that will be him if you passed him on the street you wouldn't turn your head to look back at him because there'd be nothing different to do nothing to look at his whole success of his mission depends on being completely unnoticed and being so

completely normal so completely average you say he was in his late 30s or early 40s I have no idea how many I was once how many years he's been around years would have no significance a year is the time it takes our plans to make one rotation about the Sun spaceships and wikis don't rotate about times and years have no significance at all a second of our time is the time required for a pendulum of a certain length to make one swing on any other planet that time would be totally different all of our time bases are connected

inextricably with our own science what is age would be and just translated into earthly years and I have no idea but you would say he was you would say he was the one who was the one who was the one who was the one who was the one who was the one who was the one who was the one who was in his late 30s early 40s other than that you wouldn't say you could walk past him a dozen times on the street and when someone asked you what he looked like that he said gee I don't remember I never noticed him he looked too ordinary I don't have a phone number for him at the present time I mean this could be difficult besides it would be exceedingly expensive he can communicate with me without any trouble if he needs to it's a one-way thing I mean he can reach me see when he says don't call me I'll call you

I can't call him but he can tell me any kind of way no I mean through a device which he has we would call it telepathy here because that's what it is it is there it is amplified by an electronic circuitry and if you get a copy that tape over there that has two lectures on and they're going to play the one on the physical aspect of ESP and then learn a lot about the two tapes is who like to collect the time on that case there and they went to a lot of these things I'm pretty getting a little too late to start any more like me and more like tonight I've been to court by but that baby is on his on those tapes and some

of them is in some of the data but a bit of it is in the book the lifetime Vincent we have that here too which gives it minute by minute account of exactly what happened to quite some produce on on the evening the 4th of July yes I if I'm lucky I get enough to pay for the gas and I have never made the living and unfortunately I'd be much slender than I am if I depended on it for a little I do hopefully get enough to pay the cost of the motor vehicle which I drive I came down here some 800 miles for four lectures elections for

the genetics foundation and that was the principal I had agreed to lecture from because I figured that that time passes don't hold a meaningful convention and I was the kind of toy be down here anyway I decided not to have one price it is the clear it isn't this year's no having on this here at the point I was making but I had to come down anyway but I said well least I'll give you two more like this to justify in some ways 1600 miles round-trip that I have to drive I don't know Van has been paying for a eight years to my knowledge that he's never going to have another one.

I never believed him, and it was never true until this year. But there is great problems there. It's a tremendous amount of work getting ready for that convention. It's a tremendous amount of work afterwards. He worked for several weeks afterwards, cleaning up after it. He's never yet made it up to the dining front. He's never yet gotten quite enough to pay for all the toilets. He had to put up about ten of those portable toilets for that convention.

They cost him $35 a day apiece. He passes around a tin can and says, put something in it if you want to help pay the cost. And all these conventions, and he's put them on ever since 1950, 1954, I think, was the first one. All those conventions he's never yet broken even on. It's always costing him money. He doesn't have any charge at the gate.

And the newspapers make fun of him and ridicule him and say he's running after them. Get rid of him. Get rid of him. He's a rich, quick steamer or something. And he just gets peppered and gets tired of having the name without ever having any of the game. And paying through pocket and time and so forth

would be a public service. And while many people appreciate it, they take it for granted. I mean, it's like pulling an apple from the tree. I mean, many people expect service from me and I give it to them and I don't charge anything. They don't really feel any thankfulness in their heart because it's a problem of public utility.

When you pluck an apple from a tree, how many people, when you pluck an apple from a tree, say, oh, thank you, tree, for producing this apple? How many have ever done it? You take it for granted. You take it for granted. The apple's there. There's no charge.

You pick it, you eat it, and you enjoy it. But you never think of thanking a tree for producing it. So, anyhow, I don't know exactly what all the things were. One of the problems was that last year, last year there were quite a number of black panthers there. They came very close to having a riot. And he, I guess, just didn't say there was any use in it. They had hit these the year before

and quite a lot of hit these this last year. But they didn't bother anything. They were just there. But they had a bunch of the black panthers that were looking for an excuse to make trouble. And while I'm sure Van could cope with it, a riot is not good under any circumstances. But he can cope with it enough.

The panthers, this is just what the panthers are always doing, making fun of the, you know, and so forth. But, and even they, I mean, I look at every, at every group. Every group has purposes for existence. And in their minds, at least, they are good. I can see the purpose back of the black panther organization.

I can see some of the things they're doing. I can see the benefits in it. It's just that they don't take the very practical way to reach the goals that they hope to reach. If those goals can't be reached in that manner, then they haven't been learned yet. How big is Merlin? How big is Merlin?

That's a question we can't answer at the present time because it hasn't been incorporated, which means there are no official boundaries. And the entire area is populated, more or less. So you have to draw theoretical boundaries and say Merlin goes from here to here to here to here. Then you can say how many people are in tight. But until you establish artificial boundaries,

because there are no actual boundaries, yet we do have a plan to incorporate. It is a city. And the boundaries we have picked for incorporation would enclose, I think, about 1,800 people. How big of an area is Merlin? About six square miles. What is the word in here?

Grants Pass. Grants Pass, Oregon. It's in the southwestern corner of Oregon. Is the property expensive? It isn't expensive. It's quite cheap compared to property here. It's going up in price sometimes simply because it's a city.

It's going up in price sometimes. But there is a tremendous range of property values there, depending, for one thing, on how far you are away from the freeway, how far you are away from the river, how close the nearest power pole is, and all these things. Land along the river is pretty expensive.

I wouldn't build there anyhow because that's one place you might have problems. I said the weather in Oregon may sometimes be inconvenient. It may be unpleasant. It is never. It's never dangerous. Not in that area.

Weather has never caused any destruction. Even the biggest floods when half of northern California was flooded and quite a bit of Oregon was flooded, we had no problems there at all. No, there was no damage at all. The weather can be unpleasant, but it's never dangerous.

Well, this is the point that I was making, that there are almost an infinite range of prices depending on where the acre is. You can buy a single acre. The problem of buying one acre is that you are paying a good deal, more for the cost of subdividing and you're paying for the land.

It's still possible to buy land up there for around $200 an acre. But a surveyor will charge you $500 an acre to subdivide it into one acre pieces. They are the same as here. And if you go through the subdivision procedure, you have to present the county an engineering drawing of the final subdivision

and the engineer will charge you at least $1,000 for drawing the thing. So it isn't the cost of land. It's the question of how much it has been subdivided. And what's the cost of the subdivision? What's the cost of the improvements? And so forth.

Yeah. Yeah. We're getting violent signals here that it's kind of long-sensitive. We run out of time. Did you have one more question? Do you have any golf courses? Yes.

Two. Two very beautiful ones. You'll enjoy them. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.